Final UPDATE. PSA Guarantee on a doctored card - Actual good news this time

[jayshum]

Originally Posted by Snowman

Lol. Ya, I'm calling bullshit on the 11 second load time.

It took about 15 seconds for the database to load so that I could search it. However, the message saying that the database was loading and please be patient with the spinning icon was still present even after I was able to search in it.

[Snowman]

Originally Posted by jayshum

It took about 15 seconds for the database to load so that I could search it. However, the message saying that the database was loading and please be patient with the spinning icon was still present even after I was able to search in it.

Again, I'm calling bullshit. It does not load in 15 seconds. It takes minutes to load. The webpage itself loads, and a few dozen rows of cards might load in 15 seconds, but the full excel file is not loading in 15 seconds.

[Peter_Spaeth]

Let me guess. Only water was used, and there was nothing to disclose.

[Snowman]

Originally Posted by Peter_Spaeth

Let me guess. Only water was used, and there was nothing to disclose.

This is a classic example of what I keep talking about over and over and over. Someone on a web forum calls out a card and posts inaccurate/manipulated images that do not actually represent what the card looks like or looked like, or in this case both. Then they post these doctored before vs after images to make it appear as though something has been done to a card which in fact has not been done to it (in this case the implication is clearly that some sort of chemical bleaching/ateration has occurred). And you bought it hook line and sinker, because hey, look at those images! Yet, in hand, the card itself clearly has off-white dirty borders and has not been bleached at all, as also evidenced by the more accurate scans posted above. The very scans that Tiffany originally found of the card yet intentionally ignored because they didn't fit her agenda.

[Exhibitman]

[jayshum]

Originally Posted by Snowman

Again, I'm calling bullshit. It does not load in 15 seconds. It takes minutes to load. The webpage itself loads, and a few dozen rows of cards might load in 15 seconds, but the full excel file is not loading in 15 seconds.

You can call it whatever you want, but after about 15 seconds, there were rows from the database displayed. I then did Ctrl-F and searched for Williams and it showed a count of 97 and took me to the first example which was Billy Williams near the bottom of the list.

[TiffanyCards]

Originally Posted by jayshum

You can call it whatever you want, but after about 15 seconds, there were rows from the database displayed. I then did Ctrl-F and searched for Williams and it showed a count of 97 and took me to the first example which was Billy Williams near the bottom of the list.

Some people will never figure it out.


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[steve B]

I doubt a simple soaking in water would remove a water stain like that.

[tjisonline]

Originally Posted by steve B

I doubt a simple soaking in water would remove a water stain like that.

Yes, it 100% can. For people trying to avoid buying cleaned cards, I highly recommend watching online content to see how it’s done or better yet, simply buy a few old vintage common cards to try it yourself. That’s how I learned to help avoid buying cleaned cards at shows & in auctions. I taught myself how to spot cleaned cards (not perfect but helps). Dr Beckett talked many times on his podcast about high grade vintage cards looking unnatural. That is why I think over 50% of mid to high end vintage cards have been cleaned at some point. I remember dealers taking about soaking cards during the 1980s as a kid. That’s why I think many of us have unknowingly cleaned cards in our vintage collections whether we are aware of not. It’s up to you to believe it or remain ignorant

E.g. I work in IT Security & Integration Program Mgt. How do you think we learn to continuously protect our systems? Like the FBI, other companies, etc… we hire, attend lectures , & study former hackers to teach ourselves. We just don’t guess or reuse online posts. Like most things in life, need to study the opposition to learn.

[TiffanyCards]

Snowman can you provide the cert # or the additional images of the 1953 Jackie Robinson when it was in a PSA 2.5 holder? Thanks

[steve B]

Originally Posted by tjisonline

Yes, it 100% can. For people trying to avoid buying cleaned cards, I highly recommend watching online content to see how it’s done or better yet, simply buy a few old vintage common cards to try it yourself. That’s how I learned to help avoid buying cleaned cards at shows & in auctions. I taught myself how to help spot cleaned cards (not perfect but helps). Dr Beckett talked many times on his podcast about the vast majority of vintage cards looking unnatural. That is why I think over 50% of mid to high end vintage cards have been cleaned at some point. I remember dealers taking about soaking cards during the 1980s as a kid. That’s why many of us have cleaned cards in our vintage collections whether we are aware of not. It’s up to you to believe it or remain ignorant

E.g. I work in IT Security & Integration Program Mgt. How do you think we learn to continuously protect our systems? Like the FBI, other companies, etc… we hire, attend lectures , & study former hackers to teach ourselves. We just don’t guess or reuse online posts. Like most things in life, need to study the opposition to learn.

I agree on cleaned cards, and regular stains. It happens all the time, and sometimes isn't a bad thing.

That sort of water stain though usually has had the paper damp enough that the sizing has slightly broken down letting the fibers expand. It's possible soaking and pressing would fix that issue, but the discoloration is also usually very deep into the cardboard. I have doubts that just water would fix that sort of stain.

I may do some experimenting, and see if I can cause then fix that sort of stain.

[Snowman]

Originally Posted by tjisonline

Yes, it 100% can. For people trying to avoid buying cleaned cards, I highly recommend watching online content to see how it’s done or better yet, simply buy a few old vintage common cards to try it yourself. That’s how I learned to help avoid buying cleaned cards at shows & in auctions. I taught myself how to help spot cleaned cards (not perfect but helps). Dr Beckett talked many times on his podcast about the vast majority of vintage cards looking unnatural. That is why I think over 50% of mid to high end vintage cards have been cleaned at some point. I remember dealers taking about soaking cards during the 1980s as a kid. That’s why many of us have cleaned cards in our vintage collections whether we are aware of not. It’s up to you to believe it or remain ignorant

E.g. I work in IT Security & Integration Program Mgt. How do you think we learn to continuously protect our systems? Like the FBI, other companies, etc… we hire, attend lectures , & study former hackers to teach ourselves. We just don’t guess or reuse online posts. Like most things in life, need to study the opposition to learn.

Exactly this! The number of people just talking straight out of their ass on this subject is hilarious. Just toss a 10¢ common into a bucket of water and let it dry ffs. It's not rocket science and you might learn something.

[Snowman]

Originally Posted by steve b

i doubt a simple soaking in water would remove a water stain like that.

lol